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GraffleFraff
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PostSubject: WikiLeaks   Tue Dec 07, 2010 11:57 pm

I think this is a good topic for us, because it's worldwide news, not just American news. Usually when we bring up news topics, it's only relevant in one country, which I think makes it difficult for the Australians and Alek to relate to.

If you haven't heard about WikiLeaks, I'd encourage you to look it up and read about it, because it's a major issue right now. I'm betting though, that most of you have and have some strong opinions about it. Or at least, I'm hoping you do, because I think it makes for an interesting discussion. So my questions to all of you are:

What do you think? Is it a corrupt website, or is it a breath of fresh air? Did they leak too much? Do you think the sex offender claims against the founder are legit? Do you think it's more important for our governments and major businesses to tell the truth, or do you think it's more important for them to lie about things to protect our general overall well-being?
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iAlexxx!
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 12:08 am

lol...
Wikileaks is like.... dunno how to explain it =/
I don't think its a corrupt website and it doesn't need to b censored by anything or anyone
its the plain ol' thruth about whats happening in the world
If we aren't informed about it then how the Hell do they expect us to grow as a country?
Mexico is a GREAT example of it

Did u guys know that goverment actually doesn't care about education?
yeah sure they build schools... but what about academic lvl?
its not good for the goverment to have ppl that know WTF they are doing and how they are doing it becouse that'll lead to another Revolution...

The ppl that I know that know about this is like.... 2 out of 20
the rest doesn't even know or doesn't care
If something needs to change is Education =P

Now if Goverment and Major Bussiness had to tell the truth...
I think you know my answer =P
HELL YEAH TELL IT! O:<
Being behind Lies = Corruption
Truth = BINGO! JUSTICE!
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GraffleFraff
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 12:16 am

iAlexxx! wrote:

Did u guys know that goverment actually doesn't care about education?
yeah sure they build schools... but what about academic lvl?
its not good for the goverment to have ppl that know WTF they are doing and how they are doing it becouse that'll lead to another Revolution...

The ppl that I know that know about this is like.... 2 out of 20
the rest doesn't even know or doesn't care
If something needs to change is Education =P


I think that's a good point. I think even more so, if Mexico upped their standards for education, it would help with the drug cartels. I think that people turn to businesses that are shady, like drugs, because they weren't provided the right opportunities via education to succeed in life.
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 12:40 am

I'm not very much informed on this subject, I saw it on the john stewart show yesterday and I thought it was interested but forgot to research it, honestly I'm not too interested anymore.
But I feel the information divulged was necessary.
What I think is a good discussion that partially relates: governmental control over illegal substances.
They're actually making a shit load of money off of these things, but at the same time losing, so what if they controlled intake as well as ... creation(?) so we'd lose money for a few years until it would be a completely controlled environment, no addicts, pure substances, no more dealers, public outbreaks from high street walkers. Everyone would be supervised in small centers.
But that's just wishful thinking I suppose.
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GraffleFraff
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 12:50 am

Well, depending on the drug you're talking about, I don't think that the government can control it's creation. Maybe though,

What I thought was interesting about your post was that you said your government is making money off of these illegal substances? In America, it's actually the opposite. Because marijuana is illegal, we lose money in law enforcement fees. If the government actually made it legal, the number I read was that we'd have an additional $1.7 billion because we'd save on enforcement and bring in money from taxes.
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:02 am

Hence, if we legalise as many drugs as we can that totally don't fuck you up completely, everything can be moved into these rehabilitation centers, rehab would have complete control and would be able to help people a lot easier, it would become more like a pub, that's also a securly controlled environment that safe for both non users and users. In shady business, people would put other chemicals in there, abraxo cleaner, etc. Just so they'd have more pure substance for more clients.
In this case there wouldn't be that problem, so we wont be inhaling badly with broken syringes or using techniques used in the 4th century.
Now look at Amsterdam, it has legalised drugs, not in a manner of what I speak. But it's still there, they actually have a pretty awesome culture and economy going on, be that as it may that's probably because of the tourist rate, people want to get high with a cop and ride a horse without knowing what the fuck is going on. I don't know.
It's just an opinion ;D
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GraffleFraff
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:10 am

It's an interesting theory. Make it legal, because then the government could regulate it, and there'd be less illegal activity (I know I'm oversimplifying, I'm tired). It works for prostitution too. My friend used to say if prostitution was legal, the government could regulate it and make sure that all the prostitutes and clients had regular STD tests, which would help put a cap on the spread of AIDs. I think some things seem better in theory, than in practice though. Who knows though, maybe we'll find out in a few years.
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:19 am

GraffleFraff wrote:
I think some things seem better in theory, than in practice though. Who knows though, maybe we'll find out in a few years.

I think that's everyone's mindset so far, everyone knows it's a good idea, but at the same time everyone's too scared to put it into practise. It's too delicate, needs a lot of publicity and it's too huge of a change for people to reverse, it's not safe. If it fails, we're fucked and our economy would die. If it suceeds we'd actually evolve our lifestyles and become a very peaceful community, controlled yes. But we're already as controlled as it is, who the fuck cares?
I think everyone should at least do a poll, and finally fix this thing, I agree with the prostitution, like part of the job is having constant health checks. Prostitutes would be protected by government officials, not these weird gangsta pimp fools (San andreas, been playing a bit too much of it...)
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Shen
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:23 am

I don't know a lot about it. I just know about the info on the civillians that were killed by the us troops that was hidden. I can argue for and against the website. Things like that you can see why they want to keep hidden, but will revealing do much good? I havent seen any benefits of the leaks yet, i think if anything its caused more problems right? Maybe we should keep that stuff locked up. Or maybe i am completely ignorant, since im basing this off of little info.
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GraffleFraff
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PostSubject: Re: WikiLeaks   Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:32 am

@Kish Well the way it would work in America is that one state would try it, and if it worked out then it'd would go national. But to be honest, I don't see it happening here for a very long time. I also think that the concern with allowing the government to regulate everything, is that it might give the government too much control.

@Omar I think your argument is legitimate. There are definitely things that are better to keep a secret. However, there are instances where wikileaks is doing a lot of good. For instance, say an employee of a company realizes that the organization he works for is doing something unethical. He doesn't want to lose his job, but at the same time he doesn't feel right working for this company that's doing something like this. In that instance, he submits to wikileaks the unethical thing that his company is partaking in, and once it is made public the company is forced to change it's ways. I think the debate is really about much information is too much information. Who decides what should be leaked, and what should remain a secret.
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